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2 лет тому назад
Earlier today I was working on a new project, and honestly I was enjoying building it, the style of the buildings were typical Brazilian from the region where I live, but then it happened what I didn't expect for today. At first I don't blame anyone for what happened but honestly it made me pretty upset. Angelio went to visit me as usual, then Swaleha as usual, so far so good just that two random Russians showed up, I kindly asked them in English not to claim nearby, but they didn't respond, I was still hoping to They spoke English, but they still didn't respond. They kept roaming around, and I had to watch them. I didn't have enough gold to cover what they would possibly claim, my warnings were not enough. They tried to claim 2 chunks but I saved claiming before. One of them left, but the other stayed and it was he who did the most damage, he simply claimed in the most important area. I planned to build a whole Rio de Janeiro themed place from the 60s,That made me so angry. Obi and Angelio helped me build a huge wall and isolate that claiming, but looking at that wall made me think. And in the end I am canceling that building, I was working hard to make a good atmosphere everywhere, but surely a huge wall with nothing inside will not match. I'm not going to build that place anymore, end, final point, it's over, I had everything I wanted in that place, good vegetation, a beautiful mountain range, an almost flat place, it was just perfect, after working a few days there I was finally getting what I wanted, the atmosphere was getting great, and I say with a broken heart that I finish that area, and end. It was my first security breach that caused me a good deal of damage, in fact it was just a claiming, just a stone in my path but it's a chunck-sized stone. And to prevent this from happening again, I kindly ask that anyone visiting me warn before tp to me so no problems like this will happen again. These players came to me through Swaleha but I'm sure it wasn't bad, it was an accident, a mistake on all sides, a mistake of mine for not claiming all the land before, and a mistake of Swaleha for not warning me . But that's it, we all have fighting days and glory days.
2 лет тому назад
It's for this reason why I refuse to accept new "friends". We just don't know whom to trust, and as a builder, we need to be very careful. Even the "friends" on your list can have griefers that we have no control over.
I had a couple of griefers in the newest place I'm working in, and they came because they were "friends" of my granddaughter. I told her, if she claims lots of land for building (like we were doing), she can't have "friends" in A.D.. That is sad, but true.
This is why something should be done about griefers that are claiming land, and don't use it for a period of time. When they claim land and don't use it, their intentions are obvious.
2 лет тому назад
Hey Ruan! Another day, another sad story. Hopefully we'll have some clearer skies soon. This reply isn't addressed specifically to you, just like your original post wasn't addressed specifically to anyone.
A few months ago we had an extensive forum thread about the same issue of random players claiming land. My takeaway from that was that the problem is social, not technical. Feel free to disagree with me, flame me, blame me and shame me, but I remain convinced that this problem can not be adequately solved at a technical level. Any rule can be gamed. Every system will be abused.
All technical solutions that I thought up, or that others came up with; like a claim-free border, not claiming next to friends, level minimum for claiming—all of those either don't solve the problem or make it worse. I am convinced that making claims more powerful for the "good guys" always makes claiming more powerful for the "bad guys" too.
E.g.: if I were to implement a claim-free border it's just a matter of time before some random player claims one claim away from you and suddenly there's a 3x3 gap you can never work around instead of a 1x1. And then we'll say that we actually wanted a two-claim claim-free border. So the problem increases to 5x5. Per claim. Ad infinitum.
Please yell at me, say that I'm wrong and tell me how good things would be, while showing the math—I'm all ears. I have yet to see a technical solution where "bad guys" lose out to the "good guys". And we've all put a lot of time into this already. There won't be a technical solution unless someone has a stroke of genius and irrefutably solves things. Suggest anything you want, but I'll counter with examples as to how it makes things worse.
But there is hope. Ignoring technical solutions and switching to a social standpoint opens up new possibilities. The problem then becomes miscommunication and a lack of shared values. Miscommunication, because it's impossible to talk to players you don't know using a language you don't speak. We went over this in that previous thread. Lack of shared values, since some players do not respect unwritten and imaginary boundaries set by others.
The only clear way of signaling you don't want an area to be claimed is to claim it. Boom. Problem solved. Unilaterally. Universally. It's also the perfect "technical" solution since the game rules prohibit anyone from claiming claimed land. This adds the flexibility of allowing you to create a one-claim wide border, a two-claim border, an N-claim border. Or not. Take space is green, who actually wants everybody to be able to claim along the striped road. So communicating using land claims is both the only unambiguous language you can speak and it also is the most flexible.
Does it add work? Yes. For an N^2 (N-squared) area you need to claim 4N additional claims if you want a one-claim free border. And you'll also need to plan your build in advance. If you know you want to claim a large area, do so. It's hard work, but costs a lot less effort than learning new languages and trying to communicate with players who might not know how to chat with you. This is the only viable solution I arrived at in the previous thread. Again, let me know how wrong I am.
In Ruan's story, the social problem originates from other players. More specifically friends of friends. For whatever value of "friends" you use. Some players already prune their friends list and keep it to a bare minimum to prevent this. But in the end you can never be sure who shows up N-tiers away from your own friends. So friends are a problem. Players are a problem.
Basically I should make Angeldust a single-player game. It already is, but I'd need to switch the block collections around so you can actually use all the blocks in single player. Perfect social and—in a way—technical solution. If nobody can technically get to you, no harm can be done. Why didn't I think of this before? I did. We did.
It's already in the game, when using an alt. You probably have one for claiming. So: build using a friendless alt. Problem solved, solution available today. Wrong! Alt has no drakeling. And it's actually fun to talk with others and have a shared game world and experience. So we want interaction with our friends, just not some of our friends. Or their friends.
In the end, the only solution I can imagine is a toggle button—call it incognito mode—that prevents anyone from telecharging to you. A social solution for a social problem. The button will make you appear offline while playing, but you can still use friend chat and private chat. Sounds good? I'll move aside all other work to add this on the website.
Angeldust will then forever be a single-player experience. It's not what I wanted to create, but if single player is what you want, single player is what you'll get. I know that I won't ever see some of you online again in the game, so it'll be a sweet goodbye. I'll live on in the knowledge that you are happier than before. It's a very hard choice to make and a very hard step to take, but it's the perfect "kill your darlings" moment for me and Angeldust right before the official release.
2 лет тому назад
"All technical solutions that I thought up, or that others came up with ... all of those either don't solve the problem or make it worse."
Why did you add claiming before? Why claiming is ok and a restriction about it is not?
Invisibility will not prevent griefers to ruin your build, in fact it will be almost same as it is now with my almost empty friends list.
Claim all? How can I claim all land when I have no idea how much space will I need? And no, I will not spend next X months claiming all my lands, because it would take ages, will prevent spawn of animals and will prevent to claim others on places that are ok. And I am not talking about situation, when someone claim a land while you try to claim the area.
btw, what was wrong with restrictions based on level?
Ok, make there a time limit. No one can claim next to your new claim sooner than a month after, unless you are friends.
We obviously look for some protection. How many more players have to complain? Or you wait us to leave?
2 лет тому назад
Honestly, I don't understand you. You refuse every suggestion because ... it works!
"if I were to implement a claim-free border it's just a matter of time before some random player claims one claim away from you"
At least there will be free claim buffer. At this moment, he can simply claim right next to me which is even worse. We did this conversation before. When we suggest anything, you always counter that (what a surprise) it works both way and that same rules will apply to a griefer as well. Yes, it will. I know. And?
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